:.   BLOG MENU
 
Sound Doctrine
Back To The Bible
Church History
Classic Devotion
Classic Family
Postmodernism
Purpose Drivenism
Changed Message
Today's Pragmatism
Today's Methods
Today's Synergism
Today's Worldliness
Today's Worship
Today's Evangelism
Unity at What Cost?
Wonderful Plan?
Athenian Awards
Resource Spotlight
Audio Clips
   
Google Old Truth
 
 

 

 

 

 

:.   RECENT POSTS
 
Today's Predestination Paranoia is Unwarranted

There is No Formula For Making Revival Happen

Manipulated 'Decisions' Lead To Gospel-Hardening

The Benefits of Not Ignoring Election in Your Bible

Am I Guilty of Reformed Popery and should Christians Go To Church? A response to Lee.

New Health Concerns for Jim

False Doctrine Worse Than Division

Following DeWaay Out of Purpose Driven'ism

"They're Aware of Their Sin, Why Beat Them Up?"

Taking a Few Days Off - See You Next Week

 

 

 
   Home  |   About  |  Videos   |  Calvinism
Thus says the Lord: "Stand by the roads, and look, and ask for the ancient paths, where the good way is; and walk in it, and find rest for your souls.
But they said, 'We will not walk in it.'" --Jeremiah 6:16

 

Blog: OldTruth.com :Today's Predestination Paranoia is Unwarranted


31 October, 2007   comments: (0) Postmodernism  

The Emerging Submerging of The Reformation

It's no secret that many in the Emerging Church Movement would prefer that this day be erased from their calendar. No not Halloween, though I'm sure we won't find many Emergents out today wearing Martin Luther costumes. I am instead referring to Reformation Day. One critic of Emergent correctly noted the widespread historical revisionism in the Emerging Church, saying: "All the great heroes of the faith end up becoming fools. And the antiheroes - the fools who compromise and who don't take a stand - become the heroes. It's turning history on its head; they undo the Reformation so they can go back to a quasi-Christian, medieval spirituality".

That was John MacArthur who made those remarks in an interview about his Truth War book. One reader of his book who won't be giving it a four star Amazon review anytime soon is Emergent leader Andrew Jones. His distaste for the book is stated in no uncertain terms, in fact, he says so in words that many of you will find distasteful. That's the Emerging Church that we've come to expect.

But this post is not about foul language however, nor of Andrew Jones' distain for MacArthur's book, but of Jones' interesting take on church history as expressed in the Reformation post on his Tall Skinny Kiwi blog this week. The bullet points from Andrew's post are in red below, and I will briefly challenge his ideas in the text that follows. Hopefully afterwards, you'll have a better understanding of why Emergents so often have disdain for the greatest revival of the last 1,000+ years - the Protestant Reformation.

1. The Reformers were committed to an ecumenical consensus of unity. They wanted to reform the whole church, not just one break-away segment that became the Protestant Movement. Sectarianism was not the intention.

It's true that while Martin Luther was still a Catholic monk, he endeavored to see changes made in the Roman Catholic church. But this quickly evaporated in the early days of the Reformation as it was clear that the Catholics were in no mood for sweeping reforms. It's interesting to hear Andrew Jones say that the "the Reformers were committed to an ecumenical consensus of unity" when in fact Luther broke unity even with other protestant Reformers, over sacramental doctrines. Take for example Luther's meeting with Ulrich Zwingli in which Luther refused to even shake hands with the Swiss Reformer afterwards, breaking unity with him over Communion. Luther's sentiments towards Rome were even more sectarian. Unfortunately, Andrew Jones' "unity" remarks only portray a limited portion of the story. The Reformers were indeed inclined to choose doctrine ahead of unity.

2. If there is a Babylon the Great today, it is not the Roman Catholic Church. It is probably something closer and dearer to us.

How can he be so certain of who is NOT being referred to in Revelation? I wonder if whatever entity Andrew has in mind as a better fit, has the kind of track record that the Roman Catholic church has of martyring saints, disfiguring essential biblical doctrines, and installing a leader who is said to be the Vicar of Christ on Earth (amongst other blasphemous titles). Like so many Emergents today, Andrew Jones seems more interested at times in having unity with Catholics rather than evangelizing them. Emergents may think they are being loving and charitable that way, but in reality it's extremely unloving to not tell them the truth. Andrew Jones goes so far as to offer apologies to Catholics for having once given them evangelism tracts, calling them a part of the body of Christ. I can only assume that much of his new thinking has influenced his statement of certainty regarding who Babylon the Great ISN'T.

3. If USA and England had as many Czech immigrants as they did German, history would probably show that the Reformation started much earlier and its geographic center was a few hundred miles eastwards of where we currently believe it to be. YES - I am talking about Jan Hus.

Everyone loves conspiracy theories I guess. The appeal of it to Emergents of course, is that Jan Hus of the previous century presents a more docile character to grapple with than the highly polemic Luther who once said:

"I was born to fight devils and factions. It is my business to remove obstructions, to cut down thorns, to fill up quagmires, and to open and make straight paths. But if I must have some failing, let me rather speak the truth with too great severity than once to act the hypocrite and conceal the truth."

"Geographic centers" have little to do with the perception people have of the Reformation. There's no escaping the fact that God providentially used the Magisterial Reformers, along with the rulers of the land who were favorably disposed to cooperate with them, and let's not forget His timing of the newly invented printing press. What a shame it is that numerous Emerging Church blogs on this day will invest so much bandwidth attempting to discredit such an obvious work of God.

4. The Reformation was initiated NOT because of doctrinal purity, as commonly taught, but because of corruption in the use of power and wealth. Doctrinal reform was a bonus, but not the primary motivation.

Martin Luther certainly reacted to much of the moral corruption in the Catholic church of his day, and in fact - his 95 Theses was a very moral document. Had it not been for this corruption in the church, Luther may never have published his thoughts on Justification and other important doctrines. What's not reflected in Andrew Jones' remarks however, is the acknowledgement that the Reformers thoroughly understood the relationship between thought and deeds. In other words, they understood that the corruption sprouted from error. The Reformers knew that the moral abuses were driven by wrong thinking. The Emerging Church should take a page from the Reformers, as we so often find this movement's followers emphasizing "good works" detached from doctrinal truth.

5. There is reform in the church today because there is corruption in the church today. God still cares about his church. So should we. The way we play with ecclesiastic power and the way we spend the Bride's finances should concern us all, not just our commitment to a common creed.

We can certainly agree with that. The Church today needs reform, where we radically disagree with Emergents is on how to go about it.

6. The emerging church might well be a protest (Don Carson) but it might also be a corrective measure to the excesses and imbalances of the reformation and the Enlightenment.

Or it may be a dangerous over-reaction to some of the problems that are especially pronounced in the evangelical church of the last century. The way we need to judge contemporary movements is to evaluate their truthfulness, and by this standard the Emerging Church Movement (and certainly Emergent Village) does not measure-up as a reliable source of guidance and leadership for the changes that are needed in our time.

Let the Reformation continue. Others: Reformed Trombonist and check out Campi who is always seasonal this time of year, even if he comes from a different angle than me.

Seasonal perhaps, but also - more historically accurate and less (not more) personally biased. I fully agree with Andrew Jones in recommending men like Steve Camp who will remind you of why PROTEST is part of the word "protestant", and has been for nearly 500 years.

Reformation Day is one holiday that belongs on the calendar, though I can imagine those erasers being out in full force today in Emergent households. While I do not fully agree with any of the Reformers on everything, their contribution to Christianity can not be denied. They were rough around the edges at times, some of Luther's choices of words (which are often exaggerated with no context on the blogs of his enemies) would still draw objections from me in the same way Emergents do; I also disagree with some of the doctrinal lines that were drawn (or not drawn) in the Reformation. But for their time and circumstances we must recognize that which the Lord chose to accomplish through these men. The Reformation gave the Puritans and others a steady platform to improve upon in the years that followed, and the same has been given to us. Let's remember to pray for the revival that is so badly needed in the western world today. Lord bring us more men with the conviction of truth and the courage of Luther, Calvin, and Zwingli.


Note: The topic of this post is the Emerging Church's reaction to, or misrepresentation of the Protestant Reformation. I will be asking our ECM commenters to stay on that topic, and will not be posting comments that digress into the perceived personal sins of the Reformers (a favorite topic of the ECM crowd). UPDATE 11/2/07: Andrew Jones wrote a response post, and sure enough - his commenters could not take a rest from "reformer bashing". That greatly inhibited what could have been a productive discussion on his blog about the Refomation and whether an ecumenical approach to Roman Catholics is justified (no pun intended).
UPDATE 11/2/07: More from Andrew in a new follow-up post in which he claims that my post "has turned into an emerging church bash which I had to show my wife. She shook her head." and yet the Jones family seems blind to the Reformation 'bash' going on over on Andrew's blog, complete with Reformation Day cartoons, Reformer quotes given out of context in an effort to vilify, and a constant stream of insistence that Reformed Christians such as myself have narrow and naive views of church history (aka: if we only read more modern open-minded authors - we wouldn't believe the way we do). Andrew's wife may have also missed some of the comments left here by Andrew's audience, including the "woe to you pharisees" themed 'bash' below. For a group that claims to want 'conversation' they certainly know how to put up enough barriers to it. It makes me wonder if dialog is even possible with this movement's followers.


 
 
Posted by: Jim B.   Link: http://www.oldtruth.com/blog.cfm/id.2.pid.818

 

Be the first to post a comment about this article

 

 

   Home  |   About  |  Videos   |  Calvinism

 

 


 

 

 

Church Growth Movie
Wonderful Plan?
Me Church
Amusing Goats?
Only the Good News?
Jumbotron Challenge
The History of Man
Jesus Not Doctrine?
Bible's Value To You
Evangelism Shortcuts?
Saved by MY Decision
So Easily Deceived
Marketing of Messiah
The Verse Feels Good
To Me The Bible Says
Creeds - No Need?
The Spirit Told Me
Deeds Not Creeds?
WHY We Don't Agree
Wimpy Preachers
The FALL
MORE VIDEOS

 

 

Blogs and Sites
James White
A Puritan's Mind
Puritan Sermons
Spurgeon Archives
Reformantion Ink
Tom Ascol (Founders)
Monergism
Historic Creeds
Bible Bulletin Board
Tom Chantry
Illumination
Emerging Dangers
Don Kistler
Shepherd Scrapbook
Museum of Idolatry
Strange Baptist Fire
Steve Camp
Truth Matters
Bob DeWaay
Nathan White
Grace Gems
Tom in The Box
Triablogue
Top Books
The Holiness of God, Sproul
Redefining Christianity
- (also on MP3)
The Soul Winner, Spurgeon
  No Place For Truth, David Wells
The Christian's Reasonable Service
  Sketches From Church History 
Emerging Church, Carson
  Evangelicalism Divided, Murray
Gospel According to Jesus, MacArthur
  Chosen By God, Sproul
Redemption: Accomplished and Applied, Murray
  Meet The Puritans
Puritan Reformed Spirituality
Audio Teachings
  White Horse Inn 
  Renewing Your Mind (Sproul) 
 
Lloyd-Jones Recordings Trust $ 
  The Dividing Line (Aomin)
Wild Boar
PodCast
  Grace To You
(MacArthur)
 
Handout Church History, 39 MP3's $ 
  Monergism Audio
 
Audio Sermons
Charles Spurgeon
  Joel Beeke
  FBC
Boynton Beach
  CRBC
Milwaukee
 
  GRBC
Rockford
  PRBC Phoenix 
  Twin Cities Fellowship
  Phil
Johnson
Top 10 Software
  Life and Works of Horatius Bonar
  Jonathan Edwards (Ages)
Charles Spurgeon (Ages)
  John Owen
(Ages)
  A.W. Pink
(Ages)
  John Calvin
(Ages)
  Logos Bible Software (Libronix)
  Martin Luther's Works (Libronix)
  Hendriksen NT Comm. (Libronix)
  John Bunyan
(Ages)
Blog Archives

 08 July
 
08 June
 
08 May
 
08 April
 
08 March
 
08 February
 
08 January

 07 December
 
07 November
 
07 October
 
07 September
 
07 August
 
07 July
 
07 June
 
07 May
 
07 April
 
07 March
 
07 February
 
07 January

 06 December
 
06 November
 
06 October
 
06 September
 
06 August
 
06 July
 
06 June
 
06 May
 
06 April
 
06 March
 
06 February
 
06 January

 05 December
 
05 November
 
05 October
 
05 September
 
05 August

 
 

 

Copyright 2005-2008 (C) OldTruth.com
No Duplication permitted without permission by owner